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Post by cerneo on Jan 19, 2006 14:29:31 GMT -5
I guess we look at it differently,
I don't define anything by what badges my toon has, I know what my toon is and isnt but I guess this comes more from a pen and paper back ground.
I play in such a way that shows how I myself would try to be in the star wars universe. I don't take on the role of acting like many others do. The fun for me is being able to belive that its myself doing all the things that Cerneo does ingame.
The problem we are running into is elitist thinking, we need to overcome this elder vs respec, deal or else nothing will ever get done. The undertones of this when piled up mat say a council meeting and thigs of that nature makes everyone just feel awkward.
The thing people need to understand is that, everyone lost things in the nge no one lost anything more than anyone else. PvP and high end PvE use to be an outlet pre nge now thats not an option. Teasm of 3 can do the hardest quest in game everything else is soloable by anyone with half a brain and the will to try it more than once.
PvP is extreamly out of balance, PvE is way to easy. Here we have a huge chance to start something new and fresh that might keep people playing for another month or so like I was planning to but now I am losing that vision. What I see infront of me is grumpy people whos only fun left ingame is the power trip they get from being on the 'council' that so far has done nothing of any use to anyone three meetings in.
I see nothing but council members trying to keep new people off the council. Now don't misunderstand me I don't want to be on the council at all, If everything goes to plan and DDO is half as good as I want it to be I will be there in a heart beat. Until that happens I want to try and make this system work beacuse at its core its a fantastic idea.
What we need to do as players of this broken down game that needs to be sold as scrap is build it back up from the outside in. If we can as a group get over the elitist style of thinking everything will pan out and everyone who wants to be on the council will be everyone who wants to have a good time and just pvp will, everyone who wants a strong guild with a soild playerbase of a core will have just that.
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Post by Hud on Jan 19, 2006 14:49:18 GMT -5
Hey all,
Keep this discussion going. Really need feedback on possible Padawan trials. I will be writing them up soon because Nam is now MIA and Zargos is busy IRL and I want to start putting it out there to allow people to advance.
Only thing I will say so far Cerneo, is how do you suggest you determine someones commitment to the game given that people are on on different times etc.? How would you have people advance if badges such as the "hero" ring were not to be included? Just curious to your solution to this problem.
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dunn
Force Sensitive
Jedi Knight - BLADE ( Light Order )
Posts: 4
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Post by dunn on Jan 19, 2006 15:26:10 GMT -5
iroiman, i agree with ya, and cerneo, your only 16 teen, and not to disc you, but you need to sit down and start looking at this game for the long term. The game will last longer than ya think. To much of doom and glume.
**You get what out what you put in to the game.**
If ya spend time looking at all the faulds or buga in the game, you miss the Nice Graphics, that SOE build into the game. A lot of time and efort was spent on this game to make injoyable to all of us in the Star Wars invierment. The people also make the game, with out friends and poeple to talk to, you lose injoyment. Your spending 15.00, so you should injoy the game for what it is. Let try not to rune the game for other people, it you dont like the game, move on to another one. And let those that remain, try to injoy our gameing experiance.
Sorry, not trying to Disc anyone. Just my opinion.
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Post by cerneo on Jan 19, 2006 15:27:24 GMT -5
Alright well I had posted a few ideas but I will retype them here where it will have a better layout.
Ok when you take a padawan, they need to meet a few details,
If they are 100% new player then they need to be cl30+, this shows that they have been up the legacy quest and know how to use the ingame tools to get what they want done , done, also they will already have their training saber and that an important roleplaying bit.
Next, in order to become accepted by the council they will need to show up to a council meeting, this rather than badges shows that they can be somewhere when then need to and shows far more discipline.
Once they are a padawan that is recognized by the council thy should simply start to level up and get help along the way at certain times they will have padawan trails that will be used in order to give themselves something to aim for, trails will be picked from a list of challenges, such as
Acquire a premium pearl Craft your first gen saber
Things like this, then we will also have light/dark trails specific to the guild. Such as go overt and fight along side your master for x amount of time for the darkside. For lightside maybe help out a younger padawan with one of his universal trials.
Now once padawans reach cl75-80 or so they will need to complete the final padawan trial. For this, I would like to see that said padawan must be involved in x amount of duels at council meetings for dark, and for light maybe we can have something along the lines of perfecting their sabers by having a 4th gen with full prem pearls.
Once they do this they can go along to the knight trials if they wish or simply join in with the rest of the cannon fodder.
For the knight trails, I would like to see 3 universal trials and 1 guild specific trial.
The three universal would be:
Crafting a saber with the servers best resources Winning 10-15 duels, these can be against Jedi or any other class(provide screen shots) Finding a padawan
The final challenge would be for a dark member to kill someone on the light council For light the challenge would simply presenting your case to the light council on why you should be able to join them as a fellow council member.
I feel a system like this that is very open ended can lead all sorts of fun rp, and just in general.
These are just the ideas I have had, honestly I don't mind to much one way or the other I just want it to be fun and not a mindless badge getting grind.
And I have no problem making use of quest like hero of tat as long as they are all working.
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jiquan
Force Sensitive
Posts: 33
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Post by jiquan on Jan 19, 2006 15:27:25 GMT -5
Just as a side note...I am a respec Jedi. I was only about 1/2 way through the village when NGE hit. Being a Jedi was never a priority for me under the old system. However, the game has changed and if I want to continue to be a Melee class then Jedi is my only option. I DO have better than 90 badges, have Mastered 14 or 15 professions and on that basis, I qualify to be a Council Member. I have not, and will not, ask anything out of any Padawan that I haven't completed myself. And, I actively encourage Padawans to complete whatever trials their council creates for them and take an active role in the council meetings. I have had MANY discussions with my Padawan about preparing for the Council, and have already began the search for a new Padawan for myself and a Padawan for Iroiman when he's ready. So, we're not all "elitists" and we don't all have a secret agenda. Some of us are just trying to establish order in within a failing empire.
Ji'quan
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Post by Hud on Jan 19, 2006 18:25:40 GMT -5
Heya, This is some good feedback. Just some ideas on your post Cerneo to keep the think tanks going... My biggest concern about allowing the trials to be 'open ended' and with no true structure (ie: leave the trial to the master) will be that trials can possibly be too easy and it will be harder for some rather than others. Making the system unbalanced. Therefore I believe we need to make it a "set in stone" set of trials. I want some suggestions on this however. So please give me some feedback on quests etc. that would be fiting. Also we can't have trials involving the guild because not all Padawans and Knights are part of the guild. This is not gonna change. Also I just want to clarify. I have no intentions on introducing trials for people to apply for Padawans. This application can be left simple - the Knight decides who he wants. I actually mean "Knight Trials". It's the process for a jedi to go from Padawan to Knight and become a Council Member. I call them Padawan trials because it is for Padawns Anyway lets keep the discussions rolling.
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dunn
Force Sensitive
Jedi Knight - BLADE ( Light Order )
Posts: 4
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Post by dunn on Jan 19, 2006 18:45:49 GMT -5
cerneo, i just dont agree with you, inregards to *elitist thinking*. I dont see anyone trying to be an ELITIST. We all have diffent ideas on what we want to do in the system. We all want some kind of padawan trial/knight trials. and we all want to achave great things. A lot of people are puting alot of time to get this LIGHT vs DARK, running properly. That not ELITIST's thinking. I dont realy see anyone holding anyone back, just trying to put a plan or guide/format to gether so we have a plan of how we are going to train our padawans. Let work together, and you do have some good ideas. Those that are in charge will vote on diffrent ideas, and will let us know were we are going. Dunn Dakari
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Post by semhut on Jan 19, 2006 19:20:43 GMT -5
These are all good ideas for the trials whether for Knight, Padawan, etc.. I have no idea what Hud' is thinking as far as what people should do for these, but maybe you just break it down into what being a Knight means in this system and apply challenges to reach a certain level of excellence in those areas. Leadership? Honor? Combat? Knowledge? Pick some ideals that should define us as Jedi and go from there. After all the trials are really "tests" so what are we really testing? This is somewhat similar to how the padawan trials were before the nge.
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strife
Force Sensitive
Posts: 16
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Post by strife on Jan 19, 2006 19:28:22 GMT -5
I strongly disagree with having "set in stone" trials just for the Padawan progression. For the actual Council trials that are to be completed to be on the council and become a Knight I do think they need to be "set in stone" rather than open ended. Here's basically how I think the outline the Council/Trainer should be providing:
CL40 - Trial of 'Easy' difficulty level of the Masters choice. CL60 - Trial of 'Medium' difficulty level of the Masters choice. CL80 - Trial of 'Hard' difficulty level of the Masters choice Knight Trials - A very difficult trial or set of trials that the Council gives the the Padawan. (this one would be specifically designed)
I guess I see the the CL40-80 trials more of an RP thing, but becoming a Council Member would be more specific. I think the CL40-80 trials may be something that's significant between the Master/Padawan but not something personal that Hud' or Nam/Zargos could just draw up in a procedure.
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Post by namanor on Jan 19, 2006 20:41:23 GMT -5
CL40 - Trial of 'Easy' difficulty level of the Masters choice. CL60 - Trial of 'Medium' difficulty level of the Masters choice. CL80 - Trial of 'Hard' difficulty level of the Masters choice Knight Trials - A very difficult trial or set of trials that the Council gives the the Padawan. (this one would be specifically designed)
Here's what me and zargos thought.
Basically 3 trials given by a master between becoming a padawan and becoming an knight. To make sure they are not to easy they are passed by the Padawan Trainers.
At level 40, 60, 80...a Padawan must attain a robe from the npc's that give them.
Level 40=Acolyte robe Level 60=Apprentice Robe Level 80=Knight Robe.
Also as a sort of easy trial...a master can attain materials for his padawan's saber as his saber generation progresses, and help his padawan attain pearls/crystals.
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weijou
Force Sensitive
Posts: 5
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Post by weijou on Dec 14, 2006 10:36:09 GMT -5
/point me New Member Are there any Padawan Trials for DARK' set up? And do you have to obtain 75 Badges to be on the council? My Opinion: (If anyone cares) I like how you have to kill your Master to get a spot on the council, BUT I do not think the Master should lose his/her council spot by being defeated. That will bring up a few problems that have been stated already somewhere on these forums.
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Post by Tefilp on Dec 14, 2006 10:50:40 GMT -5
We will discuss this at our meeting this sunday, as we are in the process of re-working it.
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inta
Force Sensitive
DARK JEDI MASTER
Posts: 11
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Post by inta on Dec 14, 2006 11:02:53 GMT -5
Are there any Padawan Trials for DARK' set up? And do you have to obtain 75 Badges to be on the council? Yes... as Tefilp said we are going to be discussing these topics during the meeting on Sunday. Good to see you on the forums..... There are four trails that are given, then to obtain a council seat you must duel your master. There is a grey area that will be discussed about if the master looses he will lose his/her council seat. Good questions though... /bow Inta
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Taer
Force Sensitive
Posts: 20
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Post by Taer on Dec 14, 2006 11:27:42 GMT -5
Here is a program that I put together when I was thinking of building a Jedi Academy with another guild...
CL40 – Padawan
Min. 25 Badges Acolyte Robe Crafted Saber Jedi Code Academy Studies Head Master Trial for Council Presentation
CL60
Min. 50 Badges Apprentice Robe 2nd Generation Saber Jedi Code Rebel Theme Park Nym's Theme Park Ind. Master's Trial
CL80
Min. 75 Badges Jedi Knight Robe Cloak of the Kursk/Robe of the Storm Lord 3rd Generation Saber Jedi Code Rebel Theme Park Nym's Theme Park Corvette Mission Hero of Tatooine Ind. Master's Trial
CL90-Jedi Knight
Min. 100 Badges Master Cloak 4th Generation Saber Jedi Code Rebel Theme Park Nym's Theme Park Lead a Corvette Mission Fate of the Galaxy Sher-Kar/HK-47 OR Hilt or Jinsu Hilt Bane's Heart Ind. Master's Trial Jedi Council Trial
Classroom sessions involving History of the Jedi Order; Great Jedi Masters; Crystals - Types, Damage and Meaning; History of Jedi Profession within SWG; Special Abilities and their uses; Individual Instruction with each Padawan's Master; Crafting Sessions and Discussion;
Up to CL40, all Padawans will be under the tutelage of the Head Master of the Jedi Academy. Upon completion of all of the CL40 requirements, the Head Master will assign the Youngling a Padawan Trial and, upon completion, present the Padawan to the Jedi Council to be assigned to a Master to continue his/her training.
Hierarchy…
*Council Leader/Chancellor *Council Members *Academy Master/Conselar *CL90 Jedi Masters who have taken on a Padawan for training and are waiting for a Council Seat *CL90 Jedi Knights waiting for Council Trial to be eligible for Master title and a Padawan *Jedi Guardians - CL90 Jedi who are PvP oriented and not joining the Council or taking a Padawan for training *Jedi Padawans *Younglings
The Council Leader/Chancellor oversees the Jedi Council and ensures that Council Meetings run smoothly and efficiently; presides over Council Meetings and conducts business as required. Serves as Arbiter in issues of contention within the Council
There is no emotion; there is peace. There is no ignorance; there is knowledge. There is no passion; there is serenity. There is no death; there is the Force.[1]
Jedi are the guardians of peace in the galaxy. Jedi use their powers to defend and protect, never to attack others. Jedi respect all life, in any form. Jedi serve others rather than ruling over them, for the good of the galaxy. Jedi seek to improve themselves through knowledge and training.
Peace, Taer
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inta
Force Sensitive
DARK JEDI MASTER
Posts: 11
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Post by inta on Dec 14, 2006 11:54:39 GMT -5
Great ideas... This will help us have ideas for how the training system could work. Thanks Taer for all the ideas... it will help with our decisions. Anyone else with ideas please post.... this is our time to make our training program succesful. /bow Inta
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